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ISKCON Desire Tree - Forum • View topic - sharing sinful reactions of others

sharing sinful reactions of others

sharing sinful reactions of others

Postby bhaktin carol » Thu Jun 03, 2010 8:51 pm

By which activities do we take on karma or reactions due to be delivered to others?

Do husband and wife take on what is due to the other?
If one is to shake hands with a stranger, does one then become obligated to share in some sinful reaction that was due to that stranger?
In hospital treatment, when one is given a transfusion of blood from another, is reaction that is due the donor then shared by the patient also?
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Re: sharing sinful reactions of others

Postby npawar » Fri Jun 04, 2010 1:10 pm

Hare krishna,
I heard once everything affects us.i 'll give answer to some questions.

By which activities do we take on karma or reactions due to be delivered to others?
as i understand you want to ask how we can take bad reactions of previous action which are meant for other person in order to reduce or finish his anxiety ?
answer is yes, one example from bhagvatam the younger son of king yayati took fathers old age (reaction) body from father and gave him youth body of himself. but in kaliyuga we don't have access to such activities.
but we can definately finish bad karma of person by chanting holy names of krishna specially hare krishna maha mantra***** on behalf of him.

Do husband and wife take on what is due to the other?
yes, e.g. suppose women marries poor husband then she will also become poor. if she marries brahmana she will gain knowledge. if husband stills money and wife prepare food by purchasing groccery with that money both will be affected.

If one is to shake hands with a stranger, does one then become obligated to share in some sinful reaction that was due to that stranger?

we know how planets in sky affects us, how moon affects sea it creates changes in water level.
Even touch also of perosn also affects us therefore in vedic tradition there was no hand shaking while welcoming ,In vedic system welcome is done by folding palms of hands and bowing dowm.
i know one incident prabhupada disciple was describing generally prabhupada was not allowing to touch his lotus feet but once some nondevotee people managed to touch feets , devotee were trying to stop them after that incidence prabhupada told disciples if some one touches persons feet person get karma of him.


In hospital treatment, when one is given a transfusion of blood from another, is reaction that is due the donor then shared by the patient also?
this is reaction for donor and patient both.

i want to say all reaction (bad or good) due to our material desires only, we been forced now by nature(prakriti or mayadevi) to get more and more entangle in web.here everything is illusion and misery even we may see person is materially happy but he is not if we see as it is . till we think i am body everything is misery and ignorance.

even we want to help others by sharing miseries it won't help because it is unending only thing is we first try to go out of this, like we don't know swimming but we are trying to carry other person on back and trying to cross ocean.
हरे कृष्ण हरे कृष्ण कृष्ण कृष्ण हरे हरे || हरे रामा हरे रामा रामा रामा हरे हरे||
npawar
 
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Re: sharing sinful reactions of others

Postby Benoit » Sun Aug 22, 2010 7:13 pm

Hi

I disagree that if we touch someone we will take his Karma. So when someone fall down (physically and emotionaly). You cannot help him so we are not practising religion. The foundation of all religion is to help each other in difficult times. So the people who will need more help and you do not touch him to help him. I have read many post on this forum and chat with many devotees and I see that many are obsessed to go to godhead, so they forget their relatives and think only about themselves. For me personally, these people become selfish with time because he will think that people who have problem , he deserved it because it is his karma, so nobody will help anyone. For me , all human will not go to heaven or godhead as we are all selfish. For any action we do, we do it personally for us not for god, when we pray god so that we can go to heaven if there were no heaven or godhead we will never pray god. So we and god cannot judge someone if he doing something wrong as god create human like this.

I have one more question about Karma, if someone is killed, so this person deserved it because it was his karma. So the people who kill has not done any sinful action as the dead one deserve it.
Benoit
 
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Re: sharing sinful reactions of others

Postby npawar » Wed Aug 25, 2010 12:04 pm

Hare krishna Dear Benoit,

thanks for your comments.you are compassionate soul.please find my comments between your comments in # ...$

I disagree that if we touch someone we will take his Karma.
#
e.g.
1) if someone is drowning in flood water , if we give our hand we will also drwon but i don't intend that we should not help person , if we are good swimmers we must help him but if we are not good swimmers we should stay away.
2) we sense heat ot pulse rate of body if we touch others body like that karma transfers is subtle thing
3) there are many disease which spreads due to contacts like that karma spreads.
here touch also points to association.
$

So when someone fall down (physically and emotionaly). You cannot help him so we are not practising religion.
#
we should help person but should see our capacity always, best way is to connect him to person who can really save him or sometimes we should do best leave rest to god
$

The foundation of all religion is to help each other in difficult times.
#
Yes
$

So the people who will need more help and you do not touch him to help him.
#
It is wrong, this moment started by changing hippes :( (unhappy, LSD addicted people, addicted to illicit physical relationships, criminals, unaccepted by others) to happies :P .
this society feeds arround 10 lakh poor students in india daily , i don't know about rest of world.
improving prisoners:
http://iskconprisonministry.us/
food for life pgm
http://www.middaymeal.com/aboutproject.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hare_Krishna_Food_for_Life
Hospitals:
http://www.bhaktivedantahospital.com/
Eye camp :
http://www.bhaktivedantahospital.com/Ey ... fault.aspx
Disaster relief:
http://www.bhaktivedantahospital.com/Di ... fault.aspx
farm community:
http://krisnavolgy.hu/krisnavolgygaleria/
http://www.ecovillage.org.in/

this is just few things i have mention please visit any temple and see how people are God conscious and happy and concern about all.
$

I have read many post on this forum and chat with many devotees and I see that many are obsessed to go to godhead, so they forget their relatives and think only about themselves.
#
I agree with this.but please try to think as it is.
there is strong philosophy behind this decision.most of the worlds scholars have accepted this.
actually this is beginners stage, where it is recommended to try to return kingdom of god.
every person have level of God conscious higher standard is only render unmotivated and uninterrupted devotinal service to god.
so many great souls in this moment have sacrificed everything for others only
Elevated devotees of lord are ready to go to Hell for rest of the eternity in order to save others to stay in this world (main problem is we are in this world , if we go to kingdom of God there is no problem)
one more reason that devotees are obsessed to go to godhead because then they can pull not only relatives to kingdom of godhead.e.g. like if someone from slum got posted to very high post in big company then he can request his boss to arrange needful so that he can call his whole family there and boss will arrage for it.
again free will is there if some relatives are not ready to go to nice place it is there choice.
$

For me personally, these people become selfish with time because he will think that people who have problem , he deserved it because it is his karma, so nobody will help anyone. For me , all human will not go to heaven or godhead as we are all selfish.
#
I know you have compassion towards all living entities.
please post exact question in seaperate post. i want to inform you still some people are selfless in this world but we don't have vision to see them.
$

For any action we do, we do it personally for us not for god, when we pray god so that we can go to heaven if there were no heaven or godhead we will never pray god. So we and god cannot judge someone if he doing something wrong as god create human like this.

I have one more question about Karma, if someone is killed, so this person deserved it because it was his karma. So the people who kill has not done any sinful action as the dead one deserve it.
#
Destiny is dynamic and every moment we have choice to respond to situation.
e.g. cow has given opportunity to eat grass within area of fence but if she thinks i'll not eat unless it automatically comes in side my mouth then she will miss that opportunity.
In above case few possibilities are there i want to mention one below.
if person who died was desrve to die then killer who has killed for proper reason and proper consciousness will not have sinfull reaction.e.g. soldier kills terrorist he don't get punishment but he been awarded by government.


$
हरे कृष्ण हरे कृष्ण कृष्ण कृष्ण हरे हरे || हरे रामा हरे रामा रामा रामा हरे हरे||
npawar
 
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Re: sharing sinful reactions of others

Postby vgopikrishna » Thu Aug 26, 2010 9:35 am

[Moderator's Note: We asked this question to HG Ajamila Prabhu (disciple of Srila Prabhupada) and he kindly provided his answer below. We thank HG Ajamila Prabhu for for his inputs.]

By which activities do we take on karma or reactions due to be delivered to others?

By eating food cooked by others and by others touching your feet. There may be other ways too.

Do husband and wife take on what is due to the other?

The wife shares the good karma of the husband from this life. I have not seen any reference about the wife sharing the bad karma of the husband. But if the wife assists the husband in sinful activities then she is implicated.

If one is to shake hands with a stranger, does one then become obligated to share in some sinful reaction that was due to that stranger?

Karma is passed on by touching the feet and through grains. By touching the hand of a non-devotee one gets some contamination, not reaction, which can be washed away by taking bath and chanting.

In hospital treatment, when one is given a transfusion of blood from another, is reaction that is due the donor then shared by the patient also?

Medicine can be taken on Ekadasi without reaction. So if something is taken for medicinal purpose then it is not sinful, but a sinful person's blood will have a sinful influence for sure.

If someone is killed, so this person deserved it because it was his karma. So the people who killed has not done any sinful action as the dead one deserved it.

That was Hitler's misconstrued version of Vedic philosophy. If a person kills with that mentality he gets many times more reaction according to the Bhagavatam.
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Re: sharing sinful reactions of others

Postby Benoit » Fri Aug 27, 2010 9:45 pm

Hi

Thanks for your reply, I appreciate this very much

Thanks
regards
Benoit
Benoit
 
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Re: sharing sinful reactions of others

Postby Benoit » Sun Aug 29, 2010 12:43 am

Hi

First lets introduce me, my name is Benoit and I have faith in humanity. I have more faith in my mother than God because I believe love people and help other people even if you do not pray, is a good path. I am a christian but I like to know other religion. I have followed some coran courses and soon I will go to an ISKCON temple to follow the Bhagavad-Gita courses. A colleague and a good friend of mine introduce and explain Hare Krishna movement. My colleague explain in such a way and you can see the love for krishna in the eyes of my friend. I was very interested to have this kind of love, so I have decided to read and understand Hare Krishna philosophy which is a beautiful one but my mind is a very critical one. I like religion but I do not like people who present religion as if they want to sell a goods to you (That God is the solution for all problems, if this is the case you will explain me very well and have concrete example) So every question that I will ask here is based on my actual knowledge and it is not my intention to offend any one here. From my personal opinion, spiritual knowledge must be share in these terrible time. I do not pretend to be a good person and I just want to know.

please find my comments between your comments (in red)
1 if someone is drowning in flood water , if we give our hand we will also drwon but i don't intend that we should not help person , if we are good swimmers we must help him but if we are not good swimmers we should stay away.

This is where I lost faith in God, why he do not help me to be a good swimmer so that I can help this people. God see that I will do a good action and do not help.

there are many disease which spreads due to contacts like that karma spreads.
here touch also points to association.


I still believe that you are wrong. Jesus feet was washed by Mary Magdalene. ( Jesus was a reincarnation of Krisha as Swami Prabhupada tells) I believe that "touching spreads Karma" is the invention of Man.
Can a doctor or a nurse touch a baby when he is born, they will give him their karma.

t is wrong, this moment started by changing hippes :( (unhappy, LSD addicted people, addicted to illicit physical relationships, criminals, unaccepted by others) to happies :P .
this society feeds arround 10 lakh poor students in india daily , i don't know about rest of world.


I never said that Hare Krishna movement do not help people. I know they help in different part of the world.


For the hippes changes, I have my personal opinion. If you give me permission, I will post it here

we should help person but should see our capacity always, best way is to connect him to person who can really save him or sometimes we should do best leave rest to god


When helping people, our capacity is unlimited as God will guide us. God will not act directly for him. To help a people, we will have to touche him or her at a given time. Someone who feel that there is no one who love him and he is alone in this world, you will have to listen to him or her and at a moment he or she will be happy if you hold his hand. He or she will feel the power of love transfer to him or her. I have experience this, this is great moment that the two person will never forget even in his dark days.

Elevated devotees of lord are ready to go to Hell for rest of the eternity in order to save others to stay in this world

Elevated devotees do not exist in any religion as we are all human, we have all the same characteristic. No one will sacrifice him to go to hell, because in his mind (perhaps a small part in his mind and well hidden, lets say 0.000001 %) he sacrifice in hope to go to god head.

The wife shares the good karma of the husband from this life. I have not seen any reference about the wife sharing the bad karma of the husband. But if the wife assists the husband in sinful activities then she is implicated.

This one I agree at 100%

I will continue to read and ask question and hope at the end i will find the love of God.
Benoit
 
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